Something I'd like you not to do in my journal

[andrewducker]

And, frankly, something other people would probably rather you didn't do in
their journal either:

If I post about how awesome X is, and then a bunch of people join in, also
excited about how awesome X is, and we're all dancing in a big circle,
waving our arms in the air and shouting "Woohoo for X!" then please don't
be the person who stomps in and says "X is rubbish."

Because you're taking something that people are happily enjoying, for their
own personal reasons, and mashing it down with a big grumpy hammer.

It doesn't make you cool. It doesn't make people respect your opinions
more. It doesn't change anyone's mind (if I actively enjoy X then I'm not
going to suddenly cry "What was I thinking? X actually made me feel like
someone stole my puppy!"). All it does is give you an outlet for your
venting, while reducing the happiness of the people who were, until that
point, squeeing at each other.

If you actively hate X then the place to vent about it is on _your_
journal.

This isn't to knock positive contributions. If you want to tell me that if
I like X then I might like Y even more, that's great! Deflect my
enthusiasm with your enthusiasm, and I'll feel enthusiastic about listening
to you!

And it's not to say that legitimate criticisms aren't ok - if X is made
from grinding up kittens into paste, and you think there's a chance we
don't know about that, then by all means ask if we know.

Discussion is fine. Legitimately asking why I like X, and what I think is
good/bad about it, also fine.

But please don't leap into a group of happy people and tell them that
they're wrong to like something, because frankly, it's just rude.

(Reviews are a different matter - posting a review which talks about
positive and negative aspects of something is asking for discussion of the
subject matter. I'm talking specifically about exciting, celebratory
posts.)

Comments

[bart-calendar.livejournal.com]

Who shitstomred your journal?

I'm behind on my LJ reading.

[andrewducker]

Nobody. This has been triggered by me getting increasingly fed up with that behaviour in various places.

[bart-calendar.livejournal.com]

Gotcha.

Well, as long as you don't do a long post about your love of Hall & Oates I promise never to do the shitdance in your LJ.

[poisonduk.livejournal.com]

May I just say I think X is the best thing since sliced bread! Y is a different matter though - Y is far to pretentious and IMHO smells!!

[strawberryfrog.livejournal.com]

Meh, X used to be great, but then it just went mainstream and sold out. Now it's dumbed down and the herd all like it.

[bart-calendar.livejournal.com]

I'll have you know I was listening/watching/masturbating to X before they were popular and were still cool!

[poisonduk.livejournal.com]

OH BTW can you review Tinker Tailor please? I actually hold your reviews in more respect than most! Is it worth two hours of my time?

[andrewducker]

Done!

[momentsmusicaux.livejournal.com]

What about when Simon and I said 'meh just don't get it' about your mass wagamamma excitement on FB last week?

[andrewducker]

Depends on whether people are offering better suggestions, or just saying "I don't get it, there's lots of better places."

Basically, it's a tone thing. If you come across as accepting that other people like Wagamama, then that's fine, if you're coming across as thinking that you know best, and that other people couldn't possibly want to go there by choice, then that's bad.

[henriksdal.livejournal.com]

wait I replied to this logged in as someone else, which I have now deleted, except I can't be bothered retyping. Assume: I agree, and I'm sorry for dissing wagamamas in a superior way.

[spacelem.livejournal.com]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0la5DBtOVNI

[calum]

Does the reverse apply? If a bunch of people are saying "X sucks! We hate X", and dancing in a big circle going "Down with X".. is saying "X is cool" also spoiling the party?

Should I hide my secret love of Hall and Oates? :)

[andrewducker]

That I'm less worried about (injecting optimism into a mass of negativity doesn't sound that bad to me).

But again it comes down to tone. If you're standing there shouting "You're all idiots for not loving Britney the way I do!!!!!" then that's different to "There's this one song she did that I rather like."

[gwendally.livejournal.com]

The Golden Rule trips me up all the time. I actually prefer to know when I'm talking out of my ass. If someone says "X is wonderful!!!<3" and I figure they've missed something significant I guess I assume they would want to know. I would. But I'm a cold and callous person who lets reason and logic rule me. I understand that most humans are different than me. Better at most things. Worse at reasoning, though.

I have certainly tripped up on that a few times. But the people who are still on my friends list are people who know that I love to dive into meaty ideas. I usually take the devil's advocate position, just because "me too!" has no value in the conversation as far as I can tell.

If it is NOT a meaty idea, if there *is* a clearly nonconsequential issue, I'm never going to go say, "What, you like American Idol? That's trash!" De gustabus non disputandum est. Nor do I get into any of this on Facebook, where people's employment and family members are witnessing. (It that forum I pride myself on not saying stupid shit so no corrections are needed, but, omg, do people ever say stupid shit on Facebook!!!)

So, what do you propose I do when people say, "let's all go shoot those bastards! Yeah, killing, that's the way!" Sadly, I've witnessed a few of those. My training, my instinct, is to pop up and say, "not okay. Hatred not okay. Violence not okay. Stop this now."

Is that okay?

Edited to add: also, from my point of view, hardly ANYTHING is wonderful. EVERYTHING has pluses and minuses, trade-offs. So anyone asserting something is wonderful is automatically wrong. Being okay with the minuses is fine, but ignoring them? That implies something else.

[andrewducker]

It's people who don't seem to realise that de gustabus non disputandmum that get to me.

[marrog.livejournal.com]

I know that I piss on popular things around the place on a semi-regular basis, but I hope (!) that I do it in a way that's a little more constructive/inviting of debate than this. Partly because (in my short memory) I tend to be expressing reservations about things I in fact like also but have X or Y issue with - Doctor Who being an excellent example, True Blood or Glee being others. Certainly I never intend to lessen anyone else's enjoyment of a thing.

So if I've been guilty of being pointlessly negative then many apologies - I'll certainly keep an eye on my own behaviour for a bit until I forget again.

[andrewducker]

Thank you, appreciated, and I haven't noticed you doing that recently!

[chuma.livejournal.com]

"But please don't leap into a group of happy people and tell them that they're wrong to like something, because frankly, it's just rude."

What if someone just voices their own opinion as in "I don't like X because Y"? Surely getting a range of opinions is the point of things like this rather than always having your opinions reaffirmed? Or is it entirely the phrasing such as "X sucks! I have no idea why you like it." being unreasonable?

[andrewducker]

Depends on tone (see above).

Coming in with a positive, understanding attitude, and realising that people may actually like something different is a whole lot better than implying that they only like it because their mother is also their sister.

[don-fitch.livejournal.com]

I've been known to post an "I'm not all that Enthusiastic over X, because...." comment when a bunch of people in a general-discussion group start squeeing over X, but that's partly to maintain my Grumpy Old Geezer image, and I generally leave it at that single posting. Except when X is a Politician and thus likely to have some significant effect upon my life & well-being.

But yes (reading too much between the lines, perhaps) an "X Fan Club" group is not the place to do this.

[zz]

Woohoo for grinding up kittens into paste!

[andrewducker]

I do tend to find the fluff sticks in the back of my throat.

[octopoid-horror.livejournal.com]

People who are on the OMG THIS SHOW IS AMAZING side don't often seem to realise that when someone voices polite and rational dissent, they are the rude ones, shouting that person down saying SHUT UP THIS SHOW IS AWESOME.

Then the dissenters become rude because the fans, in my experience, overreact to even the slightest suggestion that someone might not like the thing they like so the dissenters then overreact more but since people who really enjoy the show seem barely able to comprehend people who can't, they see even mild dislike as being something crazy. This has happened to me quite a lot.

Also, when you're posting links as opposed to personal opinion, you (deliberately) avoid stating your opinion on the matter, and people may well not have read all the other comments on the post.

[sttatus-quo.livejournal.com]

But please don't leap into a group of happy people and tell them that they're wrong to like something, because frankly, it's just rude.
For some people it seems to be sport.

Kindness and the concept of sportsmanship have, to a high degree, evaporated from people's lives. Especially on the internet.