andrewducker: (Jesus!)
[personal profile] andrewducker
Here is a funny-because-it's-true piece on memory, perception and free will. It's well worth a read, just to remind yourself how things _really_ work :->

Date: 2008-02-13 09:29 am (UTC)
yalovetz: A black and white scan of an illustration of an old Jewish man from Kurdistan looking a bit grizzled (Default)
From: [personal profile] yalovetz
I've been to the Exploratorium in San Francisco and it is much fun. I've also tried out an exhibit like the one the author refers to that makes you think the bronze hand is actually yours (though the one I tried was in the V&A). The basic set up is that you put your hand into a slot underneath the bronze hand. Then you get someone else to simultaneously stroke your forefinger (out of sight) and the forefinger of the bronze hand (in sight). Then your brain pairs up tactile sensation and visual data to tell you that yes, that bronze hand being stroked really is your hand, yes, the one being stroked. Weird. But cool.

Date: 2008-02-13 09:39 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] lizzie-and-ari.livejournal.com
NIce article. Memory is freaky. I have a very clear memory of riding my red tricycle (oddly) into a wire type fence covered in plants at my brother's birthday party. I fell off it and had to go to hospital to have stitches in my head.

This is not what happened. We were having dinner at home in an ordinary fashion and I was rocking on my chair and cracked my head on the radiator. This I do not remember. I do, however, believe my mother.

Wtf?

Hope you're having a spiffing day.

L xxx

Date: 2008-02-13 11:12 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] likeneontubing.livejournal.com
i'm pretty sure we can override the hormones he's talking about RE free will though

Date: 2008-02-13 11:17 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] likeneontubing.livejournal.com
eating and other things i presume he's talking about as i'm pretty sure my brain's currents have no say about which uni book i read first or something like that.

whether i eat now or later, sleep now or later etc. then yes.

Date: 2008-02-13 11:54 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] likeneontubing.livejournal.com
but isn't that just the
brain makes decision - then transfers it into communicable thought form?

ie - we have actually made the decision consciously but tthen need to transfer these signals into thoughts

Date: 2008-02-13 12:04 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] likeneontubing.livejournal.com
If you mean "our conscious mind" then no.
how not?

we say to the mind that we need decision
the mind decides
tells us.

ie the mind has still made the decision based on our likes/preferences etc.

and then we can override it.

ie i want to eat now
but i shouldn't eat now because i'm having a big tea later

Date: 2008-02-13 12:48 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] likeneontubing.livejournal.com
yes, i think so. but i don't think this is any great trickery. i think it's simply the way brains work. you made a choice based on previous assumptions/feelings etc. you can override it with a more logical choice if you wish... ie i will eat later not now. but mostly you are happy with the original choice.

i just don't get the conspiracy he's making it out to be?

Date: 2008-02-13 12:59 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] likeneontubing.livejournal.com
exactly! it's all about training your mind to think in certain ways. i just didn't realise people didn't know that hehe

Date: 2008-02-13 01:36 pm (UTC)
drplokta: (Default)
From: [personal profile] drplokta
This may be a bad analogy, because if you treat an actual army as somewhere where a command issued from above is slavishly obeyed, you're also in for a nasty shock.

Date: 2008-02-13 02:49 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pennski.livejournal.com
Now you see, this is what last night's Horizon programme should have been addressing and wasn't.

In other news, the Exploratorium is staffed by really cool people like Pat Murphy and Ellen Klages - so I'm not surprised it's a really cool place.

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