(no subject)

[andrewducker]

Originally a comment on a post of TheFerrett's about his grandmother falling apart.

I've seriously asked God for something only once in my life.

My grandmother was in hospital, obviously dying, obviously no longer there inside her own head.

It was horrible and upsetting and I knew that, having been such a strong person, seeing herself like that would have made her so sad and angry.

And despite the fact that I don't even believe there is a God, I found myself asking that if I was wrong and there was something out there, it allow this person to die before they had to suffer through any longer.

I hope that euthanasia is legal before I reach that stage, because I really don't want to go that way.

Comments

[missedith01.livejournal.com]

I feel the same way. I'd like to make a statement now about how far I want my life to go, and what particular forms of indignity I don't want to be subject to.

Sadly, seems to me that the law sometimes secures what doctors think is right for us, rather than what we feel is right. Most of us have the right to refuse treatment, most of the time, but it can be forced on us by a court on the basis of medical opinion. Meanwhile, on the one hand if we refuse to eat the medical profession may decide we should be given ECT to keep us going, on the other hand we might be marked DNR, if the same medical profession thinks it's not worthwhile keeping us alive.

I don't denigrate the doctors, but I do think it's time to bring all these things together and have a national discussion about how they interrelate and who gets to make these kinds of decisions. My own personal belief is that no-one has a right to keep me alive if I don't want to be that way.

make your wishes known

[alycekat.livejournal.com]

Maybe even more important is medical power of attorney. You give it to someone you trust, (to do what *you* want done)and thus not necessarily your next of kin. Note: even in CA, where it's all "community property" etc. a spouse does not have automatic medical power of attorney.

The spouse gets asked, naturally, when there are judgment calls to be made. But that kind of a situation leads to legal risk for the hospital & the doctor, when there is any conflicting opinion in play (say from another family member, which is the most common case, by far).

Hospitals & doctors arent the problem. The problem is legal liability, and major denial, on the part of the public. The thing to do is admit our mortality, and fill out the appropriate documents. Because you never know when you might wind up in the ER (speaking from personal experience, on that one).

Medical power of attorney is limited to medical decisions, and authorizes someone to make legally binding decisions for you, (only) when you cant make them for yourself. It's the same, legally, as having you yourself decline the treatment or the life support option.

It covers the doctor's & the hospital's ass, in terms of getting sued & allows them to do the reasonable thing, which is what they almost always want to do, anyway. (They already see way too much pain & suffering, and they generally arent out to prolong the process for anyone, least of all for themselves, when they know it's hopeless.)

Given the state of public opinion on this stuff, you should most definitely accompany that power of attorney with a very strongly worded, detailed physician's directive, to make clear to all concerned that your authorized rep is only doing exactly what you told them to do. (And dont cut off hydration - even if you're in a coma, it's horrible for your family to watch - really a gross form of death. But do cut off the machines, and the forced feedings, if you wish.)

And if this all is just too gross to face, or deal with, then you really can't complain, when health professionals have to make ass-saving decisions that you dont like.

Re: make your wishes known

[missedith01.livejournal.com]

I absolutely agree that doctors are not the problem, provided they act within the law as it stands.

I believe the legal situation is somewhat different in the UK, however this is not my area so I wouldn't be able to say for sure. I don't know whether we have an equivalent of the medical power of attorney you describe.

We do have "living wills" where an individual can set down in advance what treatment they refuse while they are still capable of doing so. I think they are legally binding but are still not infrequently ignored by doctors.

[ladysisyphus.livejournal.com]

My mother is a lawyer, and one of the things she does is Directives to Physicians -- the ones that people sign that say 'no heroic measures and I damn well mean it.' When I was younger, this creeped me out a little, but now I'm older, I understand.

I don't believe there's anything wrong with asking God for something like that; I also don't believe that you have to believe in the Divine to petition the Divine. Even if the answer you get is 'no' (or, worse, 'wait'), generally you feel better knowing that Someone/Something has heard what's on your mind.

[moniqueleigh]

Ditto on the euthanasia. I have informed (& been informed by) my husband, my mother, my brother, & quite a few friends that in the case that I am basically vegetative, Do. Not. try to keep me alive simply for the sake of having my body still taking up space.

I've seen it happen, too. It's not pretty. It's harder on the family. The goodbye's are just drawn out over a longer time. Blech. Let me/them go & get the grieving process underway. *nods*

[kpollock.livejournal.com]

Most of my dead relatives went pretty suddenly. I never see my gran (she's 85 IIRC) these days, but she seemed still with it a few Christmases ago. As nasty as ever :-)

Sean's mum (Gwen)is worried about her mother, but she sounded Ok to Sean when he was on the phone to her last week, and his uncle Tim thinks she's not so bad as Gwen makes out. A bit forgetful, in a lot of pain from arthritis and very much thinking she's not go long to go, but she does still seem mostly with it. I can see the stress on Gwen, though.

I don't want to see that mental decline in any of my family, I don't want to be there. One of my worst nightmares I had one might when I was a teenager was of my mother being totally senile and I really don't ever want to see that. I'll probably be one of those horrible children who never visit (hey I'm that already). I wouldn't want anyone around if I was losing it; I'm sure many people are the same.

I'm worried about my mum already, because she doesn't (as far as I know) do a great deal of socialising or anything that really uses your brain.

I very much doubt I'll get to be very old. I've already taken on board that life is for living NOW, while you can. I do regeret my caution with my life until recently, my conservative saving and investing and piling it up for 'later'.

To me, any death is better than gradually losing my mind - you can't guarantee to be one of the ones who ends up with the happy version of senility.

I'm getting way more forgetful already (this week I forgot totally that I'd ordered a book and that we didn't need a new VCR because I'd picked up an old one from a friend). I don't like that at all.

Rambling now, enough.