Brains

[andrewducker]

Some interesting stuff being reported in a variety of papers today about reactions to androgen and estrogen in sweat, and how gay men and straight men have a tendency to react differently to the smells.

Scientists in Philadelphia collected samples of underarm sweat from 24 donors of "varied gender and sexual orientation" and then asked 82 heterosexual and homosexual men and women to test them for any potential appealing qualities. The results revealed a divide. Gay men and lesbians showed preferences that were not those of heterosexuals of either sex. Gay men preferred the scent of gay men and heterosexual women. But, in turn, the scent of gay men was the least preferred by heterosexual men and women and by lesbians.

On the same day, the prestigious journal proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences published slightly more substantial research into what it is about male sweat that might trigger a response in the brains of gay men and heterosexual women.

Swedish scientists established in an earlier piece of research that the hypothalamus region of the brain became activated when men detected an oestrogen steroid known as EST, and women's brains in turn lit up when they got a whiff of a testosterone derivative known to biochemists as AND (that's Androgen to you and me).

In the latest study, they went further: they used brain imaging equipment to test the responses of homosexual men and heterosexual men and women, to EST, AND and other smells such as lavender. AND set the hypothalamus alight in homosexual men and heterosexual women; EST worked for heterosexual men alone.

But all of this research is about tendencies and probabilities, rather than some biological divide. A team in Oregon last year reported that they had detected a difference between rams that preferred ewes and rams that preferred each other. The difference, they reported, was in the hypothalamus. But there are only so many questions you can ask a sheep. For the moment, love remains as mysterious as ever.

Complete article here.

Comments

[cangetmad.livejournal.com]

And two posts back on my friends list is this Language Log post about the same item's use of comparators.

[andrewducker]

Yeah - I was interested in that too :->

Also noted that 'Gay men like smell of other men' isn't huge news.

Now, if we could do a survey of a suitably large number of 3 year olds, and then see how they turn out 20 years on, that would be interesting.

[laserboy.livejournal.com]

At the end of the day, does it really matter? *shrug*

[andrewducker]

Matters to me. I care about why peoples brains work the way they do.

[onceupon.livejournal.com]

But there are only so many questions you can ask a sheep. For the moment, love remains as mysterious as ever.

That is, hands down, my favorite quote of the day.

[catamorphism.livejournal.com]

rosefox pointed out that (http://www.livejournal.com/~rosefox/766822.html?nc=13) the lack of bi and trans people doesn't lend much credibility to the study (though in fairness, it's possible that they were included in the study and the media account didn't mention it).

[andrewducker]

Alas, there's not actually much money to fund these kinds of studies - largely because sexuality is still considered taboo in too many places. What we need is a sample size of at least a thousand people, and more variance in the options examined.

[0olong.livejournal.com]

That's fascinating - cheers! I've been wondering about that for years, possibly triggered by this node on Everything2, although I think I may have pondered it before that.

I wonder just how reliable an indicator it is?

[kelly-lesbo.livejournal.com]

I believe that I have a "gay brain".

The problem is the rest of my body is straight except for my left arm which is a bit bisexual.

I smell something about this study, it isn't sex hormones...

[andrewducker]

If you have a problem with the methodology, feel free to point out exactly where.

[communicator.livejournal.com]

Just at a quick glance, it is a very small sample

[andrewducker]

Yup - sure is. I'd like to see a larger study done. But the money isn't generally there to do large scale studies of this type.

[kelly-lesbo.livejournal.com]

If they used the sweat of children as the control sweat I'd have more interest. But of course if people were preferring the sweat of children that must mean they are sexually attracted to them.

Fallibility - it involves human opinions, it's fallible.

[andrewducker]

Everything is fallible. That doesn't mean you can't investigate things.

[kelly-lesbo.livejournal.com]

I don't have a problem with that as long as you don't try to give them scientific validity when it doesn't warrant it. There's lots of none sexual reasons why certain sweat is more appealling to certain groups than others.

[andrewducker]

Quite possibly. Why would that make it not science?

[kelly-lesbo.livejournal.com]

Because the grouping was in predefined human bi-polar ideas of sexuality for a kick off.

[andrewducker]

These bi-polar ideas, while simplistic, seem to cover large chunks of society. When dealing with a much larger sample size (few thousand people) then you can deal with subtlety - but you'd need much more funding for that.

[kelly-lesbo.livejournal.com]

Well bi-polarisation is a chicken and egg problem. As children we are forced into one or the other gender quite rigidly so all the people in between the two extremes get pushed to either extreme.

Even with a larger sample I find it's basic test paramerters flawed.

[andrewducker]

I'd find them simplistic. But simplistic science can give you pointers for more subtle experiments.

And I don't think that forcing people into sexuality works terribly well. If they have a strong tendency towards one side or the other then they simply hide their behaviour (and feel guilty about it, frequently). Bisexuals will obviously be swayed more easily, but history seems to show that if you force people into gender or sex roles that don't fit then they either go mad or find an outlet.

[kelly-lesbo.livejournal.com]

"but history seems to show that if you force people into gender or sex roles that don't fit then they either go mad or find an outlet."

Welcome to Earth.

[djtiresias.livejournal.com]

"Humans have phermones" strikes me as mindfuckingly obvious, although still interesting to see confirmed. Particularly interesting to see that women produce it in their urine. That certainly backs up my experience. (err...that's not as bad as it seems, but I can't explain it without TMI.)

The "results of the study were muddled among lesbians" thing was also interesting, given some other research I've seen on lesbians.

On an unrealted note, I know an awful lot of gay men who use Hobbes as their icon. Just an observation.

[sibelian.livejournal.com]

prrrr.