The problem with people

[andrewducker]

In her own journal, Sana said:

Mission was fun, although i did have a big wibble in my head halfway through when i realised that more and more it seems that my friends can only be happy if they've just been laid or are about to be, are fucked on drugs or are fucked on alcohol.

This is something that's worried me for a long time. It's been a point of derision for drinkers that non-alcoholics say things like "I can have fun when I'm sober." - as if it's not possible to enjoy yourself unless you're drunk. Everyone knows that alcoholism is bad, but how many people think about the fact that binge drinking is a nasty sign - that people feel they can't dance or sing or relax around each other unless they've first knocked out a fair number of their brain cells and reduced themselves to gibbering wrecks.

Now, I can understand that a small chunk of the population might be the kind of person who has neuroses about the public and can't cope with being around people. But apparently the vast majority of the population can't cope with the concept of having fun without alcohol. It's not just bad enough that most people feel that their Friday nights should be enhanced by alcohol - it really seems that the huge proportion of people aren't having fun unless they've drunk enough to stop thinking even slightly. Should it not be a warning to people that they can't have fun unless they're drunk? Should it not be a warning to society that it's members don't feel good unless they're incapable of walking?

We're stuck in a civilisation with a largely-christian hangover, where any example of enjoying yourself is taken as freakish. Try singing to yourself, or dancing while _sober_ and see how many people point and laugh or simply become embarassed that, God forbid, someone enjoy that kind of behaviour without being drunk. How many people do you know who will go to any kind of social event that doesn't largely revolve around alcohol?

Comments

[broin.livejournal.com]

"Try singing to yourself, or dancing while _sober_ and see how many people point and laugh or simply become embarassed that, God forbid, someone enjoy that kind of behaviour without being drunk."

Yeah. I'm on medication now.

Good point. _Every_ Friday evening in work revolves around conversations about drinking, and _every_ Monday conversation is about how drunk people got. Really, really, damned tedious.

I like my beer, and I enjoy getting drunk (though not on beer: barf), but not every damn weekend.

[blackmanxy.livejournal.com]

Those conversations are even more tedious when half your friends are stoners (and worse) and you don't drink/smoke/drug at all.

[atropinesulfate.livejournal.com]

or when you used to be just as bad but aren't any more, and you either start worrying about how immensely tedious you were, or have to try and suppress the desire to smack them round the head with an old fish supper until they give up too...

sorry, shouldn't be soapboxing, but...

Interesting

[ekatarina.livejournal.com]

I have reached the stage where "a good night out" means popcorn, movies, Sobe and tea while watching movies curled up with friends in a big "puppy-pile" on a big couch.

Okay, so I never was a big one for drinking (Okay, I did have a bad time second-year in residence at university. Wow, drinking can be expensive.) and now most of the alcohol I consume is wine with dinner or some home-made mead or wine that we are testing.

I've never had a "dry" party but I certainly do not tolerate "stupid drunk" behaviour. "Entertaining drunk" is something else and I am told I am one myself. BUt it just so isn't worth the time. I find that the people I know who still drink just don't do much else. My brother still just hangs out at Tim Horton's, goes to work, comes home, drinks, falls asleep. I have to much reading, cleaning, baking, studying, writing, making dinner for friends, driving around town to pick up people for movie night, and sleeping enough to survive work to do to not sleep well or enough.

But that is me. And I feel very old sometimes. Especially compared to my brother.

Cheers, I'll raise a Rickard's to you! Just one!

Ekatarina

[heron61.livejournal.com]

That's one of the reasons I prefer hanging out with gamers. While many of them (myself included) have done our share (or in the case of some folk I know, many people's share :) of hallucinogens, I've only ever seen one of these people more than mildly tipsy. Except for the occasional large party (something that only happens 4-8 times a year) there is almost no drinking at our gatherings. Then again, a gathering usually consists of gaming, watching DVDs, going out to dinner and talked a great deal.

I've had similar experiences with other groups of gamers - they are rarely good at really letting go, but they do manage to have fun with little or no chemical assistance.

[allorin.livejournal.com]

Despite my admitted binge last weekend, I rarely get drunk. In fact, I drink very little now - partly, I think, why I got so hammered last weekend. My tolerance has lowered.

The Christian 'thing' is definitely part of it (could be worse though - you could live in Iran). This is why, when Christianity appealed to me, I went to a Pentecostal church. Pentecostals are quite tolerant, and they're not called "happy-clappies" for nothing. As far as they could, these people knew how to hang out and have a good time without indulging in mind-affecting substances.

I don't think it's just a religious hangover though. It's more than that. It's society, and class levels, and disaffection, and more. People still talk openly about getting smashed as if it's a good thing, something 'cool' to boast about. In reality, it's incredibly ordinary, and easy. It's rather sad, I think, if that's all you have to boast about.

I think, like smoking, alcohol, or at least consumption of vast amounts of it, will become more and more taboo. I think it will be a slow thing, but hopefully by the end of our lifetimes we'll see a society that isn't so desperate to 'drown it's sorrows'. And hopefully it won't just have been replaced by something else.

[kpollock.livejournal.com]

I'm WAY to serious (most of the time) for (most) people whe sober. They'll just have to bloody well get used to it though, as I'm fed up getting nothing done. Some part of me hates the goody-goody life that has me doing all the washing and making my dinner every night and getting all my exercise done, but then again, when I drink I am not interested in much except more drink, junk food, loud conversations/arguments and sex. There is more to life than that (like gettign my black belt, learning to sail, laearnign to surf, improving my archery handicap, surviving our D&D campaign).

I have often commented that I live in the wrong country to be a non-drinker. I really is the nations drug of choice and has been for a long time.

I'm not even vaugely christian, I have no problem with enjoying myself, it's just that sober, I'd generally rather be doing something physical, or something on my own than sitting round a room/pub with people.

My main problem is that without some sort of drugs I naturally start to fall asleep about 10pm, which is considered antisocial. I had to really struggle to stay awake (failed) and really had to bitch at Sean to get us out of a frien's house a 2am at the weekend (he expressed his displeasure by bitching about my gear-chamning style all the way home). Everybody else was just fine (except one of the other sober people who HAD managed to drag her husband home about midnight).

But hey, I've always been a weirdo, if sobriety is weird, maybe I can hack it!

[rainstorm.livejournal.com]

i find that often people will try to press drink on me because i'm don't drink. they say "but you can just drink in moderation". i don't see why they believe i have to drink. i don't want to. i have made my choice and it may or may not be permanent, but it's my choice. i have a lot of fun at the mission when i'm there, mostly because i just let myself enjoy it.

sometimes i wonder whether it's for my benefit or theirs that they try to press alcohol on me. is it to make me relaxed? or is it so they feel more comfortable because i'll be drunk too?

the only reason i might want to drink is to enjoy it - some alcohol i like the taste of and kind of miss but i can live without that if i don't have the extreme negative effects that alcohol has on me.

and that's something else people appear to not believe: that the effects of alcohol can be negative. not the getting drunk part, but the fact that when i drink just a little i get very depressed. i'm not going to go through that to make other people feel more comfortable. plus, when i was getting drunk a lot i did some horrendously stupid things that i'd rather not think about. but people so often have sad to me "but you just drink a little!" as if the thought of giving it up completely is an anathema. i don't want to drink. how hard is that to understand?

[andrewducker]

i find that often people will try to press drink on me because i'm don't drink. they say "but you can just drink in moderation". i don't see why they believe i have to drink.

It does seem to be peoples expectation that people must drunk. I occasionally fancy a drink, but it's not common at all. I've almost got to the stage where I'd rather give up alcohol entirely just so that I can say to people "I don't drink" and avoid the questions about why, if I occasionally drink I'm not drinking right now. It seems to be taken as an insult that I don't drink with a particular person - as if by not drinking I'm telling them that I disapprove of their drinking.

[rainstorm.livejournal.com]

I also find that people who know i don't drink will ask me, in a pub, if i want a soft drink and when i say "no, i'm not thirsty", they seem surprised and ask me if i'm sure. yes, i'm sure, that's why i said no. being pressured into drinking coke is a weird experience and has happened more than once to me. it's as if the mere sight of a drink (it doesn't matter what) is enough to make them more relaxed.. if that makes sense?

[andrewducker]

Yeah, it makes perfect sense. I think that people feel guilty about drinking, and so need to justify it by including everyone. After all, if we're all guilty, there's no problem is there?

[rainstorm.livejournal.com]

i do feel i get looked down on like i'm trying to make a point by not drinking. i feel like people have perceived me as being self-righteous, because i don't drink or smoke, but i'm not, i just don't feel inclined to.

if people want to drink, that's their choice. i don't want to. that's mine. it should be easy to understand, but people have such difficulty because i'm being slightly different. people make such a fuss about individuality and yet in this they seem unable to countenance difference.

[rainstorm.livejournal.com]

oh, i also meant to say..

when someone next asks me why i don't drink, i'm going to ask them why they do drink and why i should justify myself to them.

[davecleghorn.livejournal.com]

I love to have a drink to unwind after work whilst watching TV, or on the PC or pop into the pub on the way home to take the edge off and chat to folk at the bar.

I usually drink at the weekends; sometimes get involved in other forms of inebriation. I like to go out to pubs at the weekends, usually followed by a club for a dance. I hardly ever become a gibbering, stumbling wreck who can’t communicate with people, quite the opposite. I usually meet new people and have a great laugh with them, talking, joking etc.

I will dance sober, I won’t sing sober or drunk! I wouldn’t wish that on anyone! I think the pub / club scene is one of the most sociable environments there is. I don’t think its inherently unhealthy or worrying (when you see certain people its worrying).

I like the feeling of being out and about in the city on a weekend, buzz in the air, people flirting with each other. I just like going out on the town and getting drunk.

I am definitely not in the minority when it comes to this in Scotland. So, I know what you mean when you say people kind of second take you when you say you don’t want a drink. “Are you sure!?” I know I’ve done it before. But that just cos its different. There’s nothing wrong with it and I think your opinion is very jaded.

[rainstorm.livejournal.com]

I hardly ever become a gibbering, stumbling wreck who can’t communicate with people, quite the opposite. I usually meet new people and have a great laugh with them, talking, joking etc.

then you're in the minority or you're not aware of how stupid drunk people are, even when they think they're at the "witty" stage.

having tried been drunk, slightly tipsy, and sober with drunk people, i can safely say the drunk people are very very boring unless you're drinking even only a little.

There’s nothing wrong with it and I think your opinion is very jaded.
nothing wrong with what? driniing? no, there isn't. it's just very sad and quite upsetting to think that people need alcohol to have a good time or to be relaxed.

if you mean there's nothing wrong with being all "but why not?!" about someone else not drinking, yes that -is- wrong. it's fukcing annoying being ask the same question over and over and it's very annoying when people seem to be trying to get you to drink when you really don't want to. being asked "but are you *sure* you don't want a drink?" five times is not funny, it's very annoying and also quite insulting that someone thinksi don't know my own mind. i'm an adult. i know what i'm doing, as much as anyone.

[davecleghorn.livejournal.com]

I agree – if you’re straight or sober at the time. It’s the same for everything. Its not a good idea to spend time in the company of people who are getting drunk, stoned, high or whatever if your not doing the same.

How often have you been in the company of your mates when theyre stoned and your not. Shit, either smoke a joint or get out of the room.

What I meant was, there is nothing wrong with NOT having a drink, obviously nothing wrong with it. But if I don’t know that someone I’m hanging out with does not like a drink and were say, in a pub I’m going to assume that they would like a drink when I’m getting one in, because most people would. And when I say, “Are you sure?” it’s the same as when I say, “Are you sure” when you say you don’t want a bit of my chocolate bar when I offer it. Its cos I’m trying to be nice.

I TOTALLY agree that it is upsetting to think that people need alcohol to have a good time or to be relaxed. I don’t. But I like to drink, I guess quite a lot. And I don't think that makes me pathetic.

[rainstorm.livejournal.com]

i like to go to the pub or to clubs to meet friends and, in the case of clubs, to dance like a muppet. i do enjoy being with friends and if i didn't go to pplaces with alcohol i would -never- see some of them. i don't want to be anti-social and not go out. i'd never have any fun.

i don't get annoyed at someone asking me -once- if i want a drink. when i say "idon't drink" i would like to be taken seriously. it's not a random whim. i thought about it quite a lot before i did it. when friends ask me, then i get annoyed, and i get annoyed at having to explain the not drinking thing and then having my explanation quetioned over and over "but you could just drink a little". "no, i don't want to." "but a little wouldn't hurt". i don't want to have to explain all the reasons to people i barely know. online it's all okay, strangely. maybe the anonymity helps. :)

i prefer to spend time with my friends than not, mostly. i just don't like people trying to force me into something i don't want to do. sometimes people forget i do't drink. but it's when they remember and yet try push me that's irritating. luckily it doesn't happen much with my good friends.

[davecleghorn.livejournal.com]

If someone’s constantly asking you if you want a drink after you’ve categorically said, ‘no I don’t drink’ then that’s completely inane. I’d just ask you if you’d like something else - orange juice..?

When I’m getting drunk I am aware of it. I know if I’m hanging about with a mate who’s not drinking the chances of me making a bit of a prick out of myself at some point (or at least it being noticed more) are increased, but I’m cool with that. I often make a prick out of myself. Andy’ll second that. Maybe people trying to pressure you into a drink is partially something to do with that.? Anyway, I agree, ‘wanna drink wanna drink wanna drink’, would be f*cking annoying!

Although I don’t think drinking culture is a bad thing, don’t get me wrong. Christ, drunk / high people can be very annoying. I was out on Saturday and bumped into a couple of girls I hadn’t seen since school. Chatted for a couple of minutes until I realised they’d probably consumed enough drink and drugs to kill a rhino. They were just a mess; its surprising they got in. I could barely understand what they were going on about although they were continually repeating themselves. They were being so fucking annoying! They also ruined any chances I might have had at pulling, as I couldn’t get away from them all night. So that basically wrecked my Saturday night. Wankers.