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Feb. 3rd, 2003 10:30 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
andrewduckerThings that annoy me #51442 - blindly following cultural definitions of aesthetics
Note: Joe, this isn't supposed to be a personal attack on you. You just happened to trigger this particular rant off.
Joe recently referred to himself as "looking like a girl" because of his long hair. I've always detested that kind of statement, because it categorises people far too tightly. "This is what a man looks like, That is what a woman looks like. If you step outside of these defined boundaries, you will look like someone of the opposite sex." It's as annoying to me as saying "This is what Black people dress like, That is what White people dress like." It's a culturally imposed straitjacket that doesn't mean anything in the greater scheme of things.
Sure, we grow up with cultural definitions for what genders look like, how they behave and how they think, and yes I think there are certain in-built tendencies, but those tendencies are purely statistical in nature and shouldn't be applied to specific people. It's like saying "Women are shorter than men." Sure, on average, but that doesn't mean that every woman is shorter than every man, or that you ought to discriminate based upon that. If height is what's necessary, then discriminate based on that, not based on averages.
I'm not sure if there would be a better way of phrasing what Joe meant (presumably "I looked reminiscient of the way that most girl's look in the culture I live in") in a way which wouldn't cause the same kneejerk response in me, and that's probably down to the fact that I've been the butt of thousands of cracks about the length of my hair (and its fuzziness, but that's generally a separate issue).
I generally object to all statements of "This is a right way to look, that is a wrong way" largely because I view all aesthetics as being entirely personal and not really any business of the person making the observation. Saying "I like the way Zebediah looks, I don't like Yves looks" is entirely reasonable, of course. Nothing wrong with stating a preference.
Note: Joe, this isn't supposed to be a personal attack on you. You just happened to trigger this particular rant off.
Joe recently referred to himself as "looking like a girl" because of his long hair. I've always detested that kind of statement, because it categorises people far too tightly. "This is what a man looks like, That is what a woman looks like. If you step outside of these defined boundaries, you will look like someone of the opposite sex." It's as annoying to me as saying "This is what Black people dress like, That is what White people dress like." It's a culturally imposed straitjacket that doesn't mean anything in the greater scheme of things.
Sure, we grow up with cultural definitions for what genders look like, how they behave and how they think, and yes I think there are certain in-built tendencies, but those tendencies are purely statistical in nature and shouldn't be applied to specific people. It's like saying "Women are shorter than men." Sure, on average, but that doesn't mean that every woman is shorter than every man, or that you ought to discriminate based upon that. If height is what's necessary, then discriminate based on that, not based on averages.
I'm not sure if there would be a better way of phrasing what Joe meant (presumably "I looked reminiscient of the way that most girl's look in the culture I live in") in a way which wouldn't cause the same kneejerk response in me, and that's probably down to the fact that I've been the butt of thousands of cracks about the length of my hair (and its fuzziness, but that's generally a separate issue).
I generally object to all statements of "This is a right way to look, that is a wrong way" largely because I view all aesthetics as being entirely personal and not really any business of the person making the observation. Saying "I like the way Zebediah looks, I don't like Yves looks" is entirely reasonable, of course. Nothing wrong with stating a preference.
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Yesssssssss
Date: 2003-02-03 03:18 pm (UTC)And nothing is more annoying then people who say you "act" like a man or a woman. Geeeeeezuz!
People act like themselves thank you very much! In fact, I wish people would start identifying with who they are on the inside rather then who they are on the outside and if that is happening, great!
What truly matters transcends physical.
no subject
I don't consider you black because you don't act black.
Are you a man or a woman? (Read: "I don't know whether to fuck you or beat the shit out of you..." Pick one and try it, peckerwood.)
You couldn't know anything about oppression, because you're bisexual and use your heterosexual privilege. (What the fuck!?!)
You're awfully quiet for an American.
People say stupid things, Andy. It's a fact of life. ;)
And I like your hair, dammit.
A.
no subject
Date: 2003-02-04 02:44 am (UTC)People (like it or not) tend to want/need to make (some)judgements on people almost instantly.
Stereotypes are shortcuts that evolved because they work (or did work) to a degree reasonable enough to provide an advantage over thinking deeply every time you meet someone ("I wonder, is he really a ruthless maniac or...ARRGHHH!!!...gack" )
No I don't like any of it either, but you can't wipe it out by wishing, by discussion or by education - as long as a portion of the sterotype is statisically true, it will be useful and thus persist.
Personally, I never minded being called 'son' up until I was about 13/14 (there was never any doubt, by the way everybody who didn't know me thought I was definitely a boy. I still very occasionally get it to this day, but only when in bulky bike leathers.)
I really don't mind what people think about me unless it gets in my way - which it very rarely does. Of course you have to live in the real world, I really am (for example) not strong enough (despite as much training as I can) to lift/carry some things, or tall enough to reach stuff/ride that monster motocrosser. People's attitude has no bearing on the laws of physics :-)
I also like Andy's hair. It's what mine always seemed to aspire to but couldn't quite achieve.
no subject
Date: 2003-02-04 03:01 am (UTC)Well, me neither.
no subject
Date: 2003-02-04 05:19 am (UTC)You could make a reasonable assumption that this is true by looking at the two human beings in question (assessing muscle bulk, limb length and leverages etc.) The convenient (though not infallible) shorthand is that women of a given size and weight carry more fat (and hence less muscle) than a man of the same size and weight and so the bloke is likely to possess more strength. (age and joint condition, other factors affecting this sort of task are also apparent by observation).
You may be wrong, but mostly you'd be right, and that's all it takes to persist as a general rule.
So if you want that heavy box put on that high shelf, you pick the tallest and strongest looking bloke - or the woman with the fork lift :-)