Debates

[andrewducker]

Earlier on in the Veils post, myself and wolflady26 had a long argument over what turned out to be a misunderstanding. Not that unusual, to be honest, pretty much all arguments either boil down to either mismatched assumptions or misunderstandings. But as she says in her final response , she was then left unsure what my actual point was.

Which is understandable, because most opinion pieces consist of "Here is a thing. I do not like this thing. Here is what must be done at once to ever prevent it happening again!" and mine consisted of the first two parts of this trilogy, lacking a conclusive call to arms to round it off.

And that's because I don't have a solution to this problem. All I have is a situation I don't like. This is more and more common for me as I grow up. I no longer believe in easy fixes to many things - all I have is either complex solutions which frankly aren't terribly punchy ways to round off a post, or (as in this case) nothing at all.

It _is_ my belief that with enough time, education, openness, etc. women's lib will reach the places it hasn't yet - and this is something which is already happening with various movements across the Muslim world (and, so I hear, even in parts of the USA), but it's not something I really have any connection to. It's just something I fervently hope.

So yes, all I was really doing was whining - explaining to the world that here is a thing, and I do not like it. I am _delighted_ that numerous people responded, some agreeing, some not, because it is a terrifying thought to me that I might stop debating things with people around me, and thus stop being told what an idiot I am on a weekly basis - that way lies fossilisation of the brain. Which, I suspect, is the main point of me posting it at all, to see what you lot thought, and whether someone would hand me a persuasive argument that changed my mind.

Comments

[autopope.livejournal.com]

Lest we forget, the legal and actual status of women in the UK in the 1870s was actually lower than it is in Iran today. Or in many other stable Muslim countries.

The improvement of the status of women in the west in the past 150 years is, as far as I am aware, historically unprecedented, and I hope it can be sustained and become universal -- but it's by no means a foregone conclusion that this will be so. We've unleashed profound reactionary forces here, and it's going to take centuries for the revolution and counter-revolution to play themselves out.

[andrewducker]

Very true. I do feel that that kind of step backwards would require a similar change in education and society in general - but there's nothing stopping that happening either.

[sigmonster.livejournal.com]

"To every human problem there is a solution - simple, convincing, and wrong." - H.L. Mencken

[surliminal.livejournal.com]

Wjen did you get home?

[andrewducker]

6-ish. I've called you twice at home and sent you a text.