Life with two kids: Bedtime arguments with a five year old

[andrewducker]

Every night for the past two weeks it's gone something like this:
Me: Gideon, do you want Daddy to shout at you?
Gideon: No
Me: I don't want to shout at you either.
Gideon: Good
Me: So, how do we make Daddy not shout at you?
Gideon: Not muck about in bed
Me: So you're going to curl up, get comfy and go to sleep
Gideon: Yes
...Three minutes pass...
Gideon: Fidgets
Gideon: Plays with his foot
Gideon: Sings songs under his breath
Gideon: Makes clicking noises
Me: Gideon, if you aren't quiet, I'll get grumpy with you. Is that what you want?
Gideon: No. I'll be good.
...Three more minutes pass...
Gideon: Sings, fidgets, rolls over, refuses to hold still, twists his arms around his legs until he looks like a pretzel, and then grins at me
Me: WILL YOU LIE STILL, STOP MUCKING ABOUT AND GO TO SLEEP.
Gideon: Gets tears in his eyes, chokes up slightly, curls up, and stops mucking about,
Gideon: goes to sleep in about 45 seconds.
Me: Is stressed for about half an hour and angry at myself.

If anyone has advice on how we can skip stages 9 through 17 I would appreciate it.

Comments

[andrewducker]

Over on Facebook a friend suggested playing music.

We played them this https://youtu.be/X2S43i66Oj8

And he definitely went over more easily.

[haggis]

Is there anything he could be doing to occupy his brain a little while his body relaxes into sleep? I was thinking of things like bodyscans or cognitive shuffling, if they could be done in a child friendly way?

[haggis]

When I was a preteen, I had to share a room with my brother one night. We chatted and messed about but when I actually wanted to go to sleep, I suggested a 'sponsored silence' and to my surprise, he went for it and we both ended up keeping silent and then falling asleep.

It sounds like movement is what is keeping Gideon awake not talking but challenging him to lie still might work?

[altamira16]

My son would amp himself up at bedtime, just one final burst of energy.

Lately, he is still doing this as a teen. This looks like him gathering the stuffed animals, putting them in our bed, bathroom, etc. in poses and waiting for us to find them when we go to bed and then cracking up.

[channelpenguin]

I have no kids, (I only brought up one kitten) but I'd be tempted to just leave him to it. Light off, shut the door, go away and ignore the noise. The logic here is that sometimes any attention is good attention, so the experts say.

I think the most important thing is that you do whatever it takes to NEVER shout at him (well, unless to alert to deadly danger!).

[juan_gandhi]

Wow.
I know we had it, but it's all happily forgotten. I only remember how both kids, hand in hand, assumed to be long asleep, were coming over to the kitchen, smiling and saying that they want to pee and some water.

[bens_dad]

My guess is that trying to be still is making him fidgety.

You being there may even be making it harder for him.

I'd leave him to it and check later. He is, after all, agreeing that he wants to go to sleep (if only to please you). Let him go to sleep his way.

[andrewducker]

He is extremely against us leaving the room.

[channelpenguin]

Well, do you always let him have his own way? I assume not. If you've not tried just leaving him to it, it really might be worth it. Especially if it stops escalation to shouty stage.

[andrewducker]

Not when I'm trying to get Sophia to sleep in the bed directly above his.

And I don't actually want to make it a horrible experience for him. I just want to find a way to make it easier for him to relax and fall asleep.

Last night music helped, we'll see how that goes tonight.

[channelpenguin]

Ah. Didn't realise they shared a room.

Glad the music helped. Let's hope it keeps doing so!

[movingfinger]

I wonder whether the whole-body tense-and-release technique would help switch off his residual fidgets? This isn't progressive relaxation, it's a single, held for a minute or so, clenching up of all the muscles one can control, then release all at once. It signals the body that whatever is out there has been dealt with and now we can relax. For some people it is more effective than the progressive techniques. For a child, one big clench (done lying down, in a position he might naturally sleep in) and letting go might be easier than inventorying from the feet up kind of things?

[andrewducker]

Good idea, I tried that with Sophia recently and it seemed to help.

[dreamaastrid]

Music worked for my kid when she was little. Classical or lullabies. She is now 22 and I threaten that I'll give her childhood nighttime lullaby CD to her husband when she marries. Turn it on and she's asleep in 5 minutes.

[birguslatro]

Sit beside the bed, tell him it's time to go to sleep, and then ignore him until he does. Perhaps?