Date: 2017-09-08 11:24 am (UTC)
danieldwilliam: (Default)
From: [personal profile] danieldwilliam
Perhaps Pro-EU Pro-Indepedence Scots should buy Bulgaria.

Date: 2017-09-08 12:35 pm (UTC)
channelpenguin: (Default)
From: [personal profile] channelpenguin
But they don't want foreigners. Not even highly skilled ones. It is a baffling attitude (to me)

Date: 2017-09-08 12:44 pm (UTC)
danieldwilliam: (Default)
From: [personal profile] danieldwilliam
It is a bit peculiar.

When the population falls to 3.5 million pensioners we could sneakily pay them to adopt us and become Bulgarians.

Date: 2017-09-08 01:08 pm (UTC)
danieldwilliam: (Default)
From: [personal profile] danieldwilliam
In all seriousness there are two things I'm mulling over her.

One is, what does happen to a country that is depopulating (relative to its neighbours). Particularly if that country is part of a free trade and free movement union like the EU.

Basic economics suggests that the price of land and property will fall quite a lot and the price of labour probably rise a little and that would encourage people to retire there.

The second thing I'm mulling over is that, if you are a poor Eastern European country and you join the EU and you don't want people to move to your country (and the criteria for Bulgarian citizenship include learning Bulgarian, so they seem serious about that) what were you hoping would happen? If there are good jobs with better pay in nice cities in other countries on offer to your young people and you are actively discouraging people moving in and you don't want your country to end up being a half-empty holiday rental retirement home why did you join the EU?

What ever the Bulgarian for puzzled is, I'm puzzled.

Re: Why join the EU?

Date: 2017-09-08 01:57 pm (UTC)
channelpenguin: (Default)
From: [personal profile] channelpenguin
Though I hear it is getting quite popular with "Digital Nomads" due to easy company setup. But obviously they don't stay...

I wonder how hard Bulgarian is to learn? Fairly. Plus, no amount of cheapness makes a country with mostly old hardline nationalists all that appealing...

Re: Why join the EU?

Date: 2017-09-08 02:50 pm (UTC)
danieldwilliam: (Default)
From: [personal profile] danieldwilliam
I genuinely wonder if it would be tolerable if you could encourage about half a million people to move to Sofia.

EU nationals get to vote in local elections...

Re: Why join the EU?

Date: 2017-09-08 02:49 pm (UTC)
danieldwilliam: (Default)
From: [personal profile] danieldwilliam
That makes sense as a model. Bulgarians must like their parents even less then Gen-Xers do.

Date: 2017-09-09 02:01 am (UTC)
randomdreams: riding up mini slickrock (Default)
From: [personal profile] randomdreams
yeah, I was all sympathy right up until that, and then I was all oh hey you've built a depopulation feedback system on purpose.

Date: 2017-09-08 12:34 pm (UTC)
momentsmusicaux: (Default)
From: [personal profile] momentsmusicaux
> Bulgaria's Deputy Prime Minister, Valeri Simeonov, rejects the idea of refugees repopulating the country
> "They have a different culture, different religion, even different daily habits," he says. "And thank God Bulgaria so far is one of the most-well defended countries from Europe's immigrant influx."

Argh.

I saw a really good article ages ago about places in Italy doing the exact opposite: taking in refugees. The older people in the village taught them about the local customs, which sure, are going to change with the addition of outsiders, but better customs that change a bit than die out completely, surely? Besides, hardly the first time that a place's customs are altered by incomers -- that's how culture evolves anyway.

Date: 2017-09-08 03:48 pm (UTC)
movingfinger: (Default)
From: [personal profile] movingfinger
The Bulgarian end game will be that the right-wing government embraces Chinese money, allowing the Chinese goverment to build factories and bring in labor to produce goods inside the EU border. This is running on a small scale in Italy and Greece now, but Bulgaria is a sitting duck for a takeover.

Bulgaria

Date: 2017-09-09 06:33 am (UTC)
darkoshi: (Default)
From: [personal profile] darkoshi
topum posts a lot about Moldova, and has mentioned the same kind of depopulation there - young people leaving for work opportunities in other countries, leaving only the old people and sometimes their own children behind.

Date: 2017-09-09 07:04 am (UTC)
momentsmusicaux: (Default)
From: [personal profile] momentsmusicaux
> Fifty–fifty split best for children of divorce

Well that's depressing, on a personal level.

Date: 2017-09-10 02:44 pm (UTC)
momentsmusicaux: (Default)
From: [personal profile] momentsmusicaux
I'll tell you all about it next time you're over for gaming if you like. Or over a drink.

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