I'm glad I don't have to date any more

[andrewducker]

Starting relationships _sucks_.  I  love being in them - but that feeling at the start where you're wondering what they think of you, and wondering if they like you as much as you like them, and thinking about what you might say to them when you next see them, and what they might say to you?  That's all stress.

Comments

[zornhau.livejournal.com]

Easiest done at uni where the churn is such that the dice have no memory and the long term cost of humiliation is zilch.

[andrewducker]

Sadly this was of no use to me at uni, when I lacked any kind of self-confidence.

[bracknellexile.livejournal.com]

Yup, starting them's a nightmare. Even getting to the start of one's a nightmare. And then when you're in them you wonder if you're trying hard enough, or too hard, or....

It's all a nightmare really.

[marrog.livejournal.com]

I blame moron feminists who see rapists and misogynists where there are actually just friendly boys.

[andrewducker]

??

I assure you that I wasn't terrified that I was about to talk to a man-hating feminist.

I was terrified that I was about to talk to a _girl_.

[marrog.livejournal.com]

Well the recent turn in modern feminism has left me terrified to talk to them, I'll tell you that.

If a guy - hell, if anyone - tried to strike up a random conversation with me on/waiting for public transport, I'd be delighted just for the sheer novelty of it (unless they were a crazy in which case I'd ignore them/escape because I'm, y'know, a grown-up).

Yet I read accounts from women who're insulted and horrified that someone would dare talk to them without preamble/introductory letter from six references including their last three girlfriends.

[hirez.livejournal.com]

I blame the decades of cultural programming which tell us that the chaps are expected to 'make the first move'.

[andrewducker]

Oh, I'm sure there are - but I've not tended to even think about that, because I assumed it was very much not the norm.

In my experience it's more that starting up conversations with complete strangers where you really don't want to look like an idiot is a very daunting thing for the majority of people.

[meihua.livejournal.com]

I find that liminal state terrifying but also rather wonderful. I can understand the, "Gosh, I'm glad I don't have to be bothered with all that any more" feeling, but. :)

I think that being poly makes it easier, too. A new relationship is still a big deal, but various other factors make it less stressful.

[meihua.livejournal.com]

I don't really want to go into this, but maybe check out this thread for a different perspective?

[marrog.livejournal.com]

Wow, a whole bunch of people I want to slap all in the same room, thank you!

Not that this behaviour's not frustrating - of course it's frustrating, and particularly so because it's all part of the Gender War. But a blanket embargo on talking to people in public is hardly the way to go, and nor is an automatic assumption that every guy who strikes up a conversation with a girl (a) fancies her AND (b) will not read cues/take no for an answer.

[meihua.livejournal.com]

> a blanket embargo on talking to people in public
>
> an automatic assumption that every guy who strikes
> up a conversation with a [woman] (a) fancies her AND
> (b) will not read cues/take no for an answer.

I don't think I've met the people who are proposing these things.

[bracknellexile.livejournal.com]

Although having a poly partner end another relationship can also be more stressful on yours.

[meihua.livejournal.com]

> poly relationships are different to mono relationships and in them, some things are easier and some things are more difficult

Why, yes, I agree! ;)

[marrog.livejournal.com]

I can use 'guy' but not 'girl'? When 'guy' is in fact etymologically the male equivelant of 'doll' or alternatively if you want to go further back 'betty', 'sheila' etc? I also sometimes refer to fully grown men as 'boys'. If they're particularly aged I call them 'lads'. They tend to really like it. I personally quite like girl, although I'm most definitely a woman. Forgive me for favouring alliteration and informality over exact specification.

I've seen internet conversations over, and over, and over, and over again where it's heavily implied that [men] just should not talk to [women] unprompted in public. At all. Because by every account in these particular circles that I see where a man has talked to a woman in public, he's been damned before he started - he says hello at a bus-stop, and earns himself a whole thread damning his presumption and utter inappropriateness.

[bracknellexile.livejournal.com]

I think there's as much of the social stigma around all unprompted conversation these days as there is gender in that (although some groups will play the gender card for all they're worth if it's a man/guy* talking to a woman/girl*)

Starting a random conversation on the bus, regardless of genders will have half the folks sat around you thinking you're some kind of weirdo. It's like the idea that you can't talk to or help a kid in the street or you're clearly a paedophile.

* - delete as appropriate

[marrog.livejournal.com]

That too, although... er, I'm tentative about jumping on a 'men are oppressed too' bandwagon though. Just because I think these women are ridiculous doesn't mean I don't believe in male privelege.

[marrog.livejournal.com]

although some groups will play the gender card for all they're worth if it's a man/guy* talking to a woman/girl

And this is the bit that makes my blood boil.

[marrog.livejournal.com]

And that's a woman, apparently. How dare you.

[hirez.livejournal.com]

Oh, absolutely. I am completely not oppressed by the idea of minding my own business on public transport.

[marrog.livejournal.com]

I actually have no problem with you talking to me on public transport provided you shut up again if I don't seem interested to talk to you.

I just think that if I take your having dared to talk to me in the first place to mean that you therefore fancy me and won't leave me alone and I then go home and whine on my LJ about being accosted by some moron who didn't respect my personal boundaries that would make me... you know. An idiot who needs to grow up and probably have their internets taken away until they can learn to suck it up and accept that not everything is the Gender War.

[andrewducker]

I actually have no problem with you talking to me on public transport provided you shut up again if I don't seem interested to talk to you.

Which is exactly what the people in that link said. And which made you want to slap them.

I'm having an understanding failure here.

[andrewducker]

There's both male and female privilege, depending on the context. Privilege, after all, just means that different (better) rules apply to one side - and is always situational. Men have it better in a lot of ways, but not as a constant.

[marrog.livejournal.com]

I'm having an understanding failure here.
Pretty much, yeah.

Edited for clarity.

[marrog.livejournal.com]

...I know that. I just didn't want to come across as "on the boys' side" just because I think a lot of girls are total morons.