andrewducker (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
andrewducker) wrote2006-01-02 11:53 pm
andrewducker) wrote2006-01-02 11:53 pm
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Screaming Queens at 10 O'Clock
I went to see The Producers a few days ago, and came out of it feeling remarkably unsure of my feelings.
Not about the movie itself (it's a competent filming of a fun musical stage-show. Worth seeing, with some wonderful moments.) but about its portrayal of gay people.
The director of the musical within the musical is gay. And screamingly camp. As is his "live-in" entourage. All of whom delight in dressing up as members of the Village People and prancing around. Except for the lesbian, obviously, who wears a shirt and is dumpy.
In other words, they're remarkably obvious caricatures. Who are then used to make jokes about gay sex and campness.
Should I be offended by this?
I mean, I'm not gay. And I know there _are_ remarkably camp people out there. And also butch lesbians in shirts.
But if the caricatures had been similarly broad takes on, say, black people - we'd have been watching blacked-up white people doing a modern Black and White Minstrel Show, and a huge fuss would have been made.
So I feel like I should have been offended, but I'm not entirely sure. Anyone else got a take on it?
Not about the movie itself (it's a competent filming of a fun musical stage-show. Worth seeing, with some wonderful moments.) but about its portrayal of gay people.
The director of the musical within the musical is gay. And screamingly camp. As is his "live-in" entourage. All of whom delight in dressing up as members of the Village People and prancing around. Except for the lesbian, obviously, who wears a shirt and is dumpy.
In other words, they're remarkably obvious caricatures. Who are then used to make jokes about gay sex and campness.
Should I be offended by this?
I mean, I'm not gay. And I know there _are_ remarkably camp people out there. And also butch lesbians in shirts.
But if the caricatures had been similarly broad takes on, say, black people - we'd have been watching blacked-up white people doing a modern Black and White Minstrel Show, and a huge fuss would have been made.
So I feel like I should have been offended, but I'm not entirely sure. Anyone else got a take on it?
no subject
Anything with stereotypes, or jokes about a particular subculture/racial group/religious group.. whatever...
List a few different groups in your head, and ask yourself if you'd be comfortable with those jokes being made about -them-.
So if you wouldn't be comfortable with that kind of stereotyping of, to continue your example, black people, then it's pretty damn clear how repulsive it must have been.
no subject
I think I feel surprised that other people aren't being repulsed by it.
But then - take Are You Being Served - that's just as bad. Should I be outraged that the BBC are re-releasing it on DVD?
Or Julian Clary - he's a caricature of a gay person. Only he's gay himself.
Is it like black people being allowed to use the word "nigger"? Are gay people allowed to be caricatures of gay people, but straight people aren't?
no subject
Some would say julian clary is okay to do it, because he's gay
Others might say the fact that people find it funny at all speaks of a deeper malaise in those finding him funny, and he's as bad for playing up to that.
Look at the still widely-held beliefs that gay people are more predatory than heterosexuals, that they're very likely to be pedophiles too, that they do X, Y and Z.
It all comes down to drawing a line between what you do and don't tolerate, and at some level, it's going to be personal. I find Will & Grace offensive (as well as just being not very good), but I can quite see that many people wouldn't, and I'm hardly going to complain.