You see, the NUS scheme will apply to ALL graduates, not just people starting new degrees in 2012. That's what they call "retroactive taxation", or changing the rules after people have already made their choices. After all, it's not like you can give your university degree BACK. Oh, but they've "had the benefit" of further education, says Harry Porter, it's only FAIR that they pay up now.
BOLLOX TO THE NUS!!! This makes me indescribably angry. As the blogger says, past grads have already made their choices, based on the situation at the time/over the course of their degree. It's ridiculous unfair to change it behind their back.
Just raising f'ing (higher rate) income tax is fairer!
Of course, what I would really like to see is university education to be free - but require a much higher entry standard in terms of academic (or artistic) performance. Yeah, I know rich kids can be tutored to the nines and all that, but it must be possible to have the entry tests/assesments favour people that can actually think/learn as opposed to the spoon-fed. Oh yeah, and chucking people out a bit more readily for not working/achieving once they are there might be a plan....
I'd like to combine this with proper apprenticeship schemes for the non-academic, where they can learn practical trades/occupations on the job, from those who are already doing it. And for those to start quite young, I doubt we'd get it below 16, but more like 14 would be better, give the kids the chance to see early that real people work, and have self-discipline and pride in their work, and to respect them for that [and themselves!] (Ok, so that'd take a bit of organising to get them under the right folks, but it could be done).
In fairness (hah, see what I did there?) the part I have a problem with is not what's being paid but how. Generating a society where it's expected and acceptable to run-up astronomical debts that no one ever reasonably expects them to pay off is... well, look at us. Although the ins and outs of the system the NUS proposes are stupid, that's not really something I personally concern myself with (a) because the NUS have always been wankers, what else is new and (b) because they're never actually going to be making the policies.
Either way, my student debt currently goes up by about £40 per month and since graduating several years ago I've paid off about £6 exactly £8 of it. And without any '30 year respite' I'll be paying it off for the rest of my life. Now with that kind of shadow over my head, why should I care if I get into other sorts of debts? It's not like I earn enough to get even a small loan to get rid of my student overdraft (I tried).
This isn't just about the physical amount of money being paid - that money has got to come from somewhere regardless. It's about the mood that it sets, the culture that it creates. Student loans have created a culture where every educated adult starts their adult life with tens of thousands of pounds worth of debt, and the poorer you started, the more debt you finish with. Where to from there?
Yes, and quite. (I had been about to waste time wondering if the NUS proposal was going to try and "retrieve" money from graduates of non-UK institutions, when I was saved by your points (a) and (b) above).
Actually, I wonder how quickly Drs Mckeith, G and Paisley, I, for example, would admit their doctorates were fake if the alternative was to be taxed an extra thousand a year or so....
I think someone should point Mr SingularityHub at the "How smart, analytical people can avoid accidentally violating the "don't be a dick" principle" link....
I agree - I actually hesitate before linking to some articles, because I don't want people to think that I approve of that kind of namecalling.
I was confused today when I noticed that the "don't be a dick" link had just posted - I assume you pick up the links either via andyduckerlinks or Twitter?
"Beware the "Fluffy" story. How manufactured news stories are used for cheap advertising"
I've lost count of the amount of news stories this year where the punchline has basically been "and it turned out there was an iphone app for something after all!"
Plus: "Dramatic rejuvenation of prematurely aged mice hints at potential therapy." - "Protecting chromosome tips doesn't just prevent ageing. It can reverse it." etc.
Of course, if it proves to work with the normally aged too, and with humans, then that won't be a time for understatement. And justify these headlines too.
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andrewducker) wrote2010-12-01 11:01 am
no subject
You see, the NUS scheme will apply to ALL graduates, not just people starting new degrees in 2012. That's what they call "retroactive taxation", or changing the rules after people have already made their choices. After all, it's not like you can give your university degree BACK. Oh, but they've "had the benefit" of further education, says Harry Porter, it's only FAIR that they pay up now.
BOLLOX TO THE NUS!!! This makes me indescribably angry. As the blogger says, past grads have already made their choices, based on the situation at the time/over the course of their degree. It's ridiculous unfair to change it behind their back.
Just raising f'ing (higher rate) income tax is fairer!
Of course, what I would really like to see is university education to be free - but require a much higher entry standard in terms of academic (or artistic) performance. Yeah, I know rich kids can be tutored to the nines and all that, but it must be possible to have the entry tests/assesments favour people that can actually think/learn as opposed to the spoon-fed. Oh yeah, and chucking people out a bit more readily for not working/achieving once they are there might be a plan....
I'd like to combine this with proper apprenticeship schemes for the non-academic, where they can learn practical trades/occupations on the job, from those who are already doing it. And for those to start quite young, I doubt we'd get it below 16, but more like 14 would be better, give the kids the chance to see early that real people work, and have self-discipline and pride in their work, and to respect them for that [and themselves!] (Ok, so that'd take a bit of organising to get them under the right folks, but it could be done).
no subject
Either way, my student debt currently goes up by about £40 per month and since graduating several years ago I've paid off
about £6exactly £8 of it. And without any '30 year respite' I'll be paying it off for the rest of my life. Now with that kind of shadow over my head, why should I care if I get into other sorts of debts? It's not like I earn enough to get even a small loan to get rid of my student overdraft (I tried).This isn't just about the physical amount of money being paid - that money has got to come from somewhere regardless. It's about the mood that it sets, the culture that it creates. Student loans have created a culture where every educated adult starts their adult life with tens of thousands of pounds worth of debt, and the poorer you started, the more debt you finish with. Where to from there?
no subject
Actually, I wonder how quickly Drs Mckeith, G and Paisley, I, for example, would admit their doctorates were fake if the alternative was to be taxed an extra thousand a year or so....
ETA: adverb, dammit!
no subject
*snigger* oh so true.... but some segments will see them as the "voice" of students. Not anyone with any sense mind you.
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I was confused today when I noticed that the "don't be a dick" link had just posted - I assume you pick up the links either via andyduckerlinks or Twitter?
no subject
I've lost count of the amount of news stories this year where the punchline has basically been "and it turned out there was an iphone app for something after all!"
no subject
http://www.nature.com/news/2010/101128/full/news.2010.635.html
Headline: "Telomerase reverses ageing process"
Plus: "Dramatic rejuvenation of prematurely aged mice hints at potential therapy." - "Protecting chromosome tips doesn't just prevent ageing. It can reverse it." etc.
Of course, if it proves to work with the normally aged too, and with humans, then that won't be a time for understatement. And justify these headlines too.