But why is it a *patriarchy* if some of it is women setting standards for women?
Elsewhere, I'm having a conversation about how I'm likely to want to stay home and raise the hypothetical kids. Both women and men have told me that's weird. In one case, that I was probably a paedophile.
If I'm getting it from both ends, so to speak, why is it a patriarchy?
Because it, in the large majority of the cases, it means men do better. Sure, men get caught on the wrong side of things too, but on average, men do better.
If we're talking childrearing, or primary school teaching (I broke off a friendship with a girl over that one - 'male primary teachers just aren't natural'), or paternity leave, not so much. If we're talking those roles even being valued, then not so much.
That's why 'patriarchy' is a harmful term. It obscures who's penalised.
Originally (when I was 15), I assumed it meant men in charge, and the mythical boardroom. How awful, sure don't want to be one of those villains. Later, I learned it was more general and described male dominance - how awful, I'll try not to be one of them either. But when I read arguments about how there's a patriarchy dominating, say, a woman-run charity, I lose track of what problem is being described.
That's not a terribly useful response. He's asking a question which a lot of people do.
And it highlights what I was saying in my other comment - if you're going to engage with people online then then they aren't going to know what you mean, or what your background is, etc. So using terms that are ripe for misunderstanding and confusion is going to make life harder.
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andrewducker) wrote2010-06-22 12:01 pm
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Elsewhere, I'm having a conversation about how I'm likely to want to stay home and raise the hypothetical kids. Both women and men have told me that's weird. In one case, that I was probably a paedophile.
If I'm getting it from both ends, so to speak, why is it a patriarchy?
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Because if we're talking average salaries, sure.
If we're talking childrearing, or primary school teaching (I broke off a friendship with a girl over that one - 'male primary teachers just aren't natural'), or paternity leave, not so much. If we're talking those roles even being valued, then not so much.
That's why 'patriarchy' is a harmful term. It obscures who's penalised.
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Because I basically agree with you. I know _why_ it has the name it has, but I don't find the general phrasing of it very useful.
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Originally (when I was 15), I assumed it meant men in charge, and the mythical boardroom. How awful, sure don't want to be one of those villains. Later, I learned it was more general and described male dominance - how awful, I'll try not to be one of them either. But when I read arguments about how there's a patriarchy dominating, say, a woman-run charity, I lose track of what problem is being described.
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And it highlights what I was saying in my other comment - if you're going to engage with people online then then they aren't going to know what you mean, or what your background is, etc. So using terms that are ripe for misunderstanding and confusion is going to make life harder.
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That's not helpful. I'm asking to learn.