andrewducker: (Default)
andrewducker ([personal profile] andrewducker) wrote2018-01-23 12:10 pm

Interesting Links for 23-01-2018

danieldwilliam: (Default)

Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] danieldwilliam 2018-01-23 01:49 pm (UTC)(link)

I quite like the idea of a bridge to Belfast. I'm in favour of interconnectivity.

But £15bn sounds like a lot of money. It is a lot of money - about half of the Scottish Government's entire annual budget.

I think the bridge would end up making Dumfries and Galloway a suburb of Belfast. Again, not bad. In fact probably a net benefit for southern Scotland and for Scotland as a whole. But something that would happen.

It does support post-Brexit Plan Number 6 - that Northern Ireland reunifies with the Republic and then Scotland joins the Confederacy of Ireland.
alithea: Artwork of Francine from Strangers in Paradise, top half only with hair and scarf blowing in the wind (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] alithea 2018-01-23 02:50 pm (UTC)(link)
I approve of Plan number 6.

Bits of south west Scotland are already suburbs of Belfast to an extent - a lot of 'questionable' people moved over when the troubles finished...

A bridge would certainly save me having to go on ferries, but yeah, that is a *lot* of money.
danieldwilliam: (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] danieldwilliam 2018-01-23 03:05 pm (UTC)(link)
I'm not adverse to Plan Number 6. It has lots of merits. I'd prefer us just to declare independence in 2018 and revoke our part of Article 50 and let the EU sort it out but Plan Number 1 might not be on offer.

But it would have to be a Confederacy with Ireland. I'm not sure I exactly want to be in a fully bound up Union with either the old Republic of Ireland or Northern Ireland. They both have some political problems in their history that I think Scotland would be all to willing and able to import if we got the chance. A beard marriage to get round Rajoy and the PP in Spain.

I'm am not at all surprised that people with a colourful past have moved from Northern Ireland to Dumfries and Galloway.

The acccountant in me is wondering how many houses would have to be built in D&G to pay for a £15bn bridge (the answer turns out to be about half a million).
alithea: Artwork of Francine from Strangers in Paradise, top half only with hair and scarf blowing in the wind (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] alithea 2018-01-23 03:28 pm (UTC)(link)
I would much prefer Plan 1 too. And definitely no importing of NI's crazy politics to Scotland (although we already have more of it lurking in corners than I'd like).
danieldwilliam: (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] danieldwilliam 2018-01-23 03:39 pm (UTC)(link)
We do seem to have more NI-type crazy here in Scotland than we'd like to admit. Probably. No one will admit to it. MLW did some work on sectarianism a few years ago. Lots of dark talk about how it continued to influence thing in the Central Belt but not a lot of concrete examples that people were prepared to talk about.

And we've had MSP's sent bullets for daring to wear Celtic shirts.

As an atheist Aberdonian and Edinburgher and an immigrant to both from England I'm a little flummoxed by the whole thing.

My only direct experiences of it are being viewed with suspicion by the local policeman in Limivady and the being visited by Orangemen looking for a toilet during the annual Orange March from the Meadows.

I'd quite like to avoid the Republic's cronyism too. That's something I fear Scotland could get really bad at.

Combining the two would be toxic.
alithea: Artwork of Francine from Strangers in Paradise, top half only with hair and scarf blowing in the wind (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] alithea 2018-01-23 04:18 pm (UTC)(link)
Yeah.

We have an Orange march that goes past our flat every year - much to the Boy's delight, being an Irish Catholic by birth :( Although last year there were more police marshals than marchers, and there weren't that many of them!

I get the impression that it's worst in Glasgow and some parts SW of it. Certainly the Boy has bad experiences of being Irish in Glasgow when Rangers are playing.

A yes to the cronyism too, it's definitely something I got whiffs off from the SNP when Alex Salmond was in charge, less so now, but I suspect it's just moved down a level and therefore become less obvious.
danieldwilliam: (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] danieldwilliam 2018-01-23 04:29 pm (UTC)(link)
Salmond was definately chummy with a number of people who perhaps got more influence over policy than they ought.

Or just got free golf courses.

The Orange March here seems to have moved. When we first moved in it was very large and right on the Meadows and there seemed to be hundreds of buses coming in from all over Scotland. If you half closed your eyes and didn't listen to the speaches it looked quite jolly. Until you remember what it is actually about.

There is also a limit to the number of bad covers of The Sash My Father Wore that one can listen to before one starts reaching for Spotify and a list of reggae covers of the Spice Girls Greatest Hits or Songs of the Venga Boys Re-imagined by Julio Inglesiaz and Ricky Martin.

Anyhow, I haven't seen it recently. Perhaps we have been away when it happened. Perhaps it has moved to some other park. Perhaps it has stopped happening.

The other stranger march was a march in commemoration of some Irish socialist nationalist (Tom Connolly). I've only seen that once but there was definately a lot of police compared to the number of marchers.

Aye - Irish Catholisism and Rangers home fans are not a happy mix.
alithea: Artwork of Francine from Strangers in Paradise, top half only with hair and scarf blowing in the wind (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] alithea 2018-01-23 04:34 pm (UTC)(link)
I'm neither Irish, Catholic nor a football follower but it seems to me like the only times there is ever trouble in Dundee over football it is because Rangers are playing. We've had riot police outside our flat on at least 3 occasions and the front of the building egged once.
danieldwilliam: (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] danieldwilliam 2018-01-23 04:39 pm (UTC)(link)
Rangers are not a class act. Neither the club nor the fans contribute positively to the nation. I was delighed when the were liquidated and relegated to the lower divisions. The best thing that has happened to Scottish football since Aberdeen won the European Cup Winners Cup.
alithea: Artwork of Francine from Strangers in Paradise, top half only with hair and scarf blowing in the wind (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] alithea 2018-01-23 04:41 pm (UTC)(link)
Agreed! The only time I've been cheered by football news in my life ;)
skington: (yaaay murder)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] skington 2018-01-23 04:18 pm (UTC)(link)
I've heard it said in Glasgow that the only reason the Troubles didn't spread to Scotland is that that's where people's grannies lived.
alithea: Artwork of Francine from Strangers in Paradise, top half only with hair and scarf blowing in the wind (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] alithea 2018-01-23 04:22 pm (UTC)(link)
That sounds entirely plausible.
skington: (heal plz)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] skington 2018-01-23 04:20 pm (UTC)(link)
One problem with a crossing - bridge or tunnel - is Beaufort's Dyke.
danieldwilliam: (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] danieldwilliam 2018-01-23 04:31 pm (UTC)(link)
A problem in terms of the engeineering needed to get over it or the munitions at the bottom of it? Or both?
skington: (brain shrug)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] skington 2018-01-23 05:19 pm (UTC)(link)
Well, it depends on whether you're building a bridge or a tunnel, I imagine ;-) .
danieldwilliam: (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] danieldwilliam 2018-01-24 02:39 pm (UTC)(link)
I'm thinking of some kind of hybrid device combining the key features of both a tunnel and a bridge.
skington: (brain shrug)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] skington 2018-01-24 02:52 pm (UTC)(link)
Sounds like... a “ferry” ;-) .
danieldwilliam: (Default)

Re: Bridge to Belfast

[personal profile] danieldwilliam 2018-01-24 02:59 pm (UTC)(link)
A ferry would combine both the experience of being inside with the practicallity of not being under the water.