andrewducker: (Default)
andrewducker ([personal profile] andrewducker) wrote2003-07-19 09:01 am

You and me. We're in this together.

John Gilmore: I was ejected from a plane for wearing "Suspected Terrorist" button.

I'm glad that someone has the moral pigheadedness to stand up for themselves. Because I suspect that I wouldn't.

[identity profile] allorin.livejournal.com 2003-07-20 11:35 pm (UTC)(link)
mis·take ( P ) Pronunciation Key (m-stk) n.

An error or fault resulting from defective judgment, deficient knowledge, or carelessness.
A misconception or misunderstanding.

v. mis·took, mis·tak·en, mis·tak·ing, mis·takes
v. tr.
To understand wrongly; misinterpret: mistook my politeness for friendliness.
To recognize or identify incorrectly: He mistook her for her sister.


I was going to ignore this (God knows I should, it's making me ill), but no, I can't. People ARE entitled to mistakes. As much as your are entitled to anything else, you are entitled to be flawed. It's what makes us both unique, and human. People aren't entitled to misconceptions that aren't mistakes, perhaps - that's a different argument. As for being sorry, or contrite for a mistake, or learning from it, that's a moral obligation. However, inasmuch as I have never met a perfect human being (unless you plan on holding yourself up in that regard?), I think we are entitled to make mistakes. Our flaws, our imperfection, give us that right. I don't believe anyone is entitled not to expect me to make mistakes. I am not perfect, and have never claimed to be. I claim the right to make mistakes - it's part of my genetic imperfection. I claim the moral right to learn from my mistakes, and apologise for them. But no one, no where, is going to tell me I cannot make a mistake, that I don't have the right to be mistaken.

[identity profile] yonmei.livejournal.com 2003-07-21 03:42 am (UTC)(link)
I'm sorry this is making you ill, and I think we're just plunging along completely misunderstanding each other.

I don't believe anyone is entitled not to expect me to make mistakes.

I agree. There is no entitlement involved in making mistakes or not making them. As you say, making mistakes is part of being imperfect. But arguing that no one is entitled to expect other people not to make mistakes is - in my view - a completely different thing from claiming that you are entitled to make mistakes. There is no "entitlement". There is only - or should be - understanding and forgiveness. I don't accept either that you're entitled to expect me not to make mistakes, or that I'm entitled to make mistakes, or the other way round - just that we should all accept that people do mistakes, everyone does, and this is why we all need to understand and forgive other people's mistakes as well as our own.