Empathic Failure

[andrewducker]

One of the strange attitudes on the spoilers post is that of people who seem insistent on telling me how I should enjoy movies.  That I pay too much attention to plot, or that I just shouldn't enjoy a movie less if I know how it's going to turn out.

This seems to be a common thread in discussion on the internet - one person says "I don't like X." and a bunch of people say that not enjoying X is immature, or that it's not that bad, or that they like X a lot, or that  they can't see X at all. 

And they don't seem to be providing this information for general cultural reasons, but in denial that the original person is "correct" to feel the way they do in the first place.

It's something I've seen repeatedly, that if unhappy people would just stop being unhappy then everything would be fine.  That they shouldn't complain about people doing things they don't like - because if they'd just learn to like people doing things they didn't like then nothing would have to change, and everyone would be happy.

You don't have to agree with people who complain - if you feel differently then you feel differently.  You don't have to stop doing the thing they feel unhappy about - that's your judgement to make.  But to hear people expressing their feelings on something and then express anger, disbelief or scorn because they have those feelings strikes me as a basic lack of empathy.

It's an attitude that completely baffles me.

Comments

[endless-psych.livejournal.com]

It's not a lack of empathy. It comes more from not believing that whatever you are doing will cause harm. When being told it does cause harm you can accept this and challenge your self image (which I would hold in most cases is "someone who doesn't do harm") and apologise. Or you can paint spoiler phobes as the bad guys.

The latter option is easier I'd wager. (I also reckon most people do this for either one thing or another)

[random-redhead.livejournal.com]

It is in part, I think, because when person A says I don't like/ didn't enjoy/ found gaping plot holes in X, to person B it feels like a critism. An implied "you are wrong to like X, it shows your tastes are poor/ unsophisticated". Person B feels the need to defend X to defend the value of their opinion as a whole.

I am really good at getting caught up in films, I feel really sorry for people who can't let go of continuity errors, I think I get more enjoyment. Unless the getting to talk about the thing you have spotted, therefore showing your superior watching skillz, provides pleasure.

[aliiis.livejournal.com]

THIS! EXACTLY THIS! Thanks Andy. I had a bad experience recently with saying I didn't really enjoy a film as much as I'd thought I was going to (not cos of spoilers, I thought it was slightly disappointing and had certain flaws). Why is it not ok to say that?
I also think people could be a little clearer on the distinction between saying 'I don't enjoy x' and 'x is BAD'. Definitely not the same!

[xquiq.livejournal.com]

Where I tend to see this is conversations online that go something like:

Person A: I feel upset by X
Person B: Don't get it / get over it / that's odd
Person A: Yeah, but I feel upset by X - you need to get that
Person B: Okay, you're upset, but sorry still don't get it
Person A: Yeah, but I feel upset by X - you need to get that
Person B: Okay, you're upset, but sorry still don't get it

& numerous variations on the theme until someone gets bored or a flame war breaks out.

What probably needs to happen in this scenario is that the two individuals stop talking about it. Person B is never going to understand person A's perspective and person A is not going to change that.

Fundamentally though, I don't subscribe to 'everyone's feelings are absolutely valid & they can express them without challenge all the time'. I think it's true most of the time, but I can think of plenty of examples where people get upset / angry where they have absolutely no right to do so or where their views are actively unpleasant. It's fair to say that none of these are in the world of film or literary criticism though ;)

[ninebelow.livejournal.com]

If someone told you they only ate crisp sandwiches, isn't it possible you would express disbelief? And if they replied "But I like them!" would that really make a difference?

[laserboy.livejournal.com]

Bear in mind the very nature of how things are discussed on the internet. That may skew the answers you're getting.

[cartesiandaemon.livejournal.com]

I think there is an implicit value judgement on the different ways of watching. Compare my response if someone says "I didn't like $longbook. It was too full of words," or "I loved Dan Brown, his puzzles are so clever". I shouldn't encroach their freedom to enjoy something their way. But I definitely want to.

And that sort of difference of opinion occurs in other cases when it's less clear-cut, and people might legitimately have different experiences, yet feel compelled to justify their own.