Things my girlfriend and I have argued about

[andrewducker]

I have spent inumerable hours arguing with a variety of girlfriends because I cannot, and will not follow this simple principle (stolen gleefully from Scott Adams' blog:

The biggest relationship mistake you can make is to assume that because you have some special training or knowledge on a topic, that your opinion should be extra important. You could be the world’s most respected expert on insects, for example, but if your mate insists that caterpillars grow into chipmunks, there will be no talking him or her out of it. You could try saying, "I have a doctorate in bugs, I know what I’m talking about" but your mate will hear "I am an overbearing ass pimple who doesn’t know a fly from a suspicious mole."

So forget about how much you know, or how smart you think you are, or how much extra information you might have recently collected. That will not help you. Instead, I offer you the only solution: The WCM Method.

WCM stands for Who Cares Most. If you want your relationship to have a chance, defer all decisions and interpretations of fact to the person who cares the most.

In practice, this will mean that women will make 98% of all the decisions and be "right" 98% of the time. Compared to men, women care more passionately about just about everything. Men mostly scratch what itches and call it good. BOCTAOE.

Many women and some men who read this blog will sharply disagree with my gross generalization. To you I say with all sincerity, "You’re right. I don’t know what I was thinking."

See how easy that is?

It's a shame really.  But what can I do - I just got to be me.

Comments

[whotheheckami.livejournal.com]

*laughs* Thanks - shame it doesn't work

[andabusers.livejournal.com]

Too right, I wouldn't do that either. I think someone that stubborn would piss me off no end, which is ironic considering what a stubborn-ass mule I am myself.

[bohemiancoast.livejournal.com]

He's spot on, and not just for relationships. If you can't manage "You're right, I don't know what I was thinking" can you manage one of the versions I use?

"I'm sure you're right" (meaning "You are wrong")
"Mmm. You're probably right" (meaning "You are so wrong. But life is too short.")
"No, no, you may very well be right" (meaning "You are so totally fuck-headed that I'm not even prepared to pretend I agree with you")

The key point is that as long as you use these forms every time it doesn't matter, then on the one occasion when you could be seriously inconvenienced by the wrong assumption, you've got the space to say

"I really did think it was y. How about we check first?"

You might also profitably watch out for the times that other people use the first three forms when talking to you. Because they're pretty much forms of words that are only used when the other person is dogmatically arguing the wrong thing. I've learnt a ton of stuff by listening out for that, moving on, and then checking and reflecting later.

[odheirre.livejournal.com]

Ironically, that's also how American politics works these days.

LOL ROFL

[surliminal.livejournal.com]

have you tried "That's a really good point but.."? that's whatI use when my students say something that's so wildly wrong headed I want to scream..!
The underlying problem is - you have to think, as I've said before, if you want to be right more than you want to be happy/to make the other person happy/to not hurt the other person.. (with an element in the formula for how abstractly important what you're arguing about actually IS.)

conversation after reading this

[diotina.livejournal.com]

P: This isn't really true, is it? I mean, I know I do insist I'm right quite a bit of the time...
F: Well, overwhelmingly, really.
P: But that's because, I am, right? I mean, you've said so yourself.........Oh.

[xquiq.livejournal.com]

I don't like that type of game playing either, as long as the other party respects my right to have an view, allows me to express it and doesn't have ridiculous expectations about my knowledge.

Example: if I learn about an area where Tim is an expert, I expect to be able to converse and to have things explained relatively gently if I'm wrong, just as I would hope to do the same if the area was one where I had the expertise. (Thankfully he does this.)

It's a delicate balance. On the one hand I feel it's important to acknowledge expertise, but on the other hand, it's also important to allow your partner to express their views and encourage their learning. It's too easy to simply tell someone their wrong in such a way as to put them off learning / expressing views and I think that's a shame.

[azalemeth.livejournal.com]

Words of wisdom wiser I have not read in quite a while :P.

[channelpenguin.livejournal.com]

god, I'd hate that. Really really hate that. I want people's REAL opinions and thoughts, not 'yes dear' to shut me up. Does anyone want that?? Nah, they can't. I want my ideas to be ACTUALLY right!!! TELL me where I'm wrong, step by step...

Just as well Scot Adams is, as always, joking.

[channelpenguin.livejournal.com]

Sometimes, I have got to the point where I really can't be bothered to argue about something any more because to logically refute the other person's argument takes knowledge that I don't currently possess, or energy that I don't currently possess and I want a rest and some thinking time. That's a tricky one - quitting when the other person is still all fired up...